Great podcast guys. I think I just don't like this issue/story of X-Men even though I am a fan of the franchise. I feel like a comic reader in that sense. When I mentioned the DOFP negates the franchise I was speaking with characters coming back to life in mind. I hate that. Not DOFP's problem, but I sort of wish they just put the First Class cast through another stand-alone adventure or (if they wanted to stick with Singer's cast) then explain a lot of shit that happened and then unhappened in X-Men The Last Stand. For example, how did Xavier get back into his old body? Why is Magneto a mutant again? These are huge issues with continuity. If I enjoyed DOFP like I liked Star Trek '09, I wouldn't care about any of this - which proves Patrick's point of forgiving the impediments of movies you like and not for movies you don't. I cry because I care :-)
I'm really interested to see how things proceed from this point forward because they now have two timelines that people are interested in: the younger, newer one and the "classic" one. Each seems to serve a different audience. As they head toward Apocalypse, I'd rather see the First Class cast take the main stage. I don't see how they can do that, but something tells me they're going to try. Maybe Apocalypse will be a threat in the 70s and in the 2000s. If comics have taught me anything it's that anything is possible. I guess we'll see.
They've actually already said Apocalypse will take place in the 80's. It will include the First Class team, but also add some of the original X-Men's younger selves. Then of course Gambit and Nightcrawler are also expected to join the team. Jackman can come along as well, since Wolverine doesn't really age. I just wonder if it's going to set itself in another factual historical event like DOFP and First Class.
My vote for the factual historical event is the launch of MTV :-) #MutantTelevision
Haha! Nice, Adam!
Something bothers me about the X-Men/X2/Last Stand timeline that I don't feel was adequately covered, and it isn't how Professor X and Magneto managed to get where they were in the future timeline of Days of Future Past. I infer that when Magneto moved the chess piece at the end of Last Stand, slowly but surely, he regained his abilities. Xavier's explanation to Logan of Kitty Pryde's abilities gave me the impression she could have had something to do with saving him. She could have been summoned to that ER to tap into Xaviar's consciousness, stuck in that other body, send it back in time, where Xavier was able to prevent his death, without preventing anything else that occurred in that film. But... there are Sentinels in the opening of The Last Stand, during the X-men training program in that simulation chamber, which would posit the existence of, at least, the type of Sentinel seen in the 70s section of Days of Future Past. Which means... what? Trask never got to experiment with Raven? I'm insinuating that the Trask of Last Stand and the Trask of Days of Future Past are the same person, just portrayed by different people. So is it safe to assume Trask got what he wanted without having to kill Mystique? She was captured in The Last Stand and questioned, but no one seemed to need her for anything beyond that. Mystique never killed Trask in the previous three films' timeline, and Trask never dissected her. A plot hole, perhaps?
*adequately covered by the movie, I meant to say.
Great show, guys! I loved this movie. Loved it, loved it, loved it. I see the nitpicks that you guys mentioned, but as Heath mentioned, the movie was working for me so much and proving to be such an enjoyable viewing experience that I just didn't care about any logic problems. The melding of the casts was great, I enjoyed the hell out of the funny moments, there was lots of great action, and I was totally into the story. As of this moment, this movie could make its way into my top 10 for the year (which could very well include two comic book movies at this point with this and Captain America: TWS).
Pretty much agree with everything you guys had to say, in that it was a very good movie with a few problems.I don't think I am as forgiving of them "rewriting" the past, and picking and choosing what works and what didn't in previous installments, as it just seems to be the easy way out. It's funny that Superman Returns did the same thing in that Superman III and IV did not exist in Singer's universe. But, it's not a huge concern going forward, it just feels like a cheat to me.I also wanted to respond to a couple of things you noted. First the metal detector scene, I think it works because it pays homage to previous movies where metal detectors always go off when Wolvie walks through. Even he expects it to go off, but obviously with his bone claws it does not. It doesn't really break the "fourth wall", because he's probably walked through them a million times, and even he notes the chance. At least that's how I interpreted it, and it didn't pull me out.Also the reason Mystique doesn't exist in the future universe is because she was killed. At least in that specific timeline she is captured after killing Trask, and is experimented on and dissected. The sentinels (nimrods) only exist because of her abilities, and she was not alive to combat them. Maybe I am way off, as that doesn't explain why she appears in the first three, but how can those sentinels exist unless that actually occurred?I still think I prefer X2 to Days of Future Past, but not by much, and that could change upon repeat viewings. I am glad you took the time to praise X-Men, and even The Last Stand for all its faults. I don't like the movie either, but like Patrick I like the ending where they put everything on the line and give us extended scenes of mutant anarchy. Although that final battle would have been much better had they used Juggernaut in the proper fashion.Also, I agree that a change of pace in story for the next one is a step in the right direction, as they don't always need to be fighting humanity to make an interesting movie.
Friend to All Children! K, that score. Mmm! I think all Ottman scores are garbage. & full disclure, I'm friends with two of the orchestrators (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orchestration), the brothers Livesay (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1950422/?ref_=ttfc_fc_cr929http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1954332/?ref_=ttfc_fc_cr930). It didn't fit. It was, hey look at that other thing, let's use that. Why does Wolverine have adamantium in the future. Does The Wolverine not exist? Did he get more metal cuz bone claws suck? I'm pretty sure thats it. He knew they blew. Also, the football stadium (was it football? or was it baseball? who cares), was the proto-Asteroid M... Guys? Where'd you go?
Wait, if the baseball stadium was supposed to conjure up images of Asteroid M then I have to say that was a failure for me. All it did was remind me that I still haven't dropped ten bucks to see Million Dollar Arm. I was thinking about something else earlier tonight that's probably unimportant to a lot of people, but when Wolverine, or Jackman, I guess, lit the cigar on the plane, he did it the right way. A lot of movies or TV shows have people striking a match and immediately lighting the cigar but cigar buffs don't do that. They "toast the foot," running the open end of it in or near a flame, insuring an even burn and no harsh flavors. It reminds me of something similar in the first Hobbit film. As Gandalf and Bilbo are talking outside Bag End, Bilbo repeatedly covers the bowl of his pipe with his fingers and palm as he puffs to keep it lit. That's something only real pipe guys would catch. These are little details that don't amount to any story significance but I notice them and appreciate them. #themoreyouknow
I personally liked Ottman's approach to Superman Returns - the mix of old and new fit the modus operandi of the movie. I also liked his old fashioned throw back score for Jack the Giant Slayer. But I totally got a temp score vibe of the Days of Future Past score.
Call me a rube (go ahead, I'll wait), but I actually loved all the Quicksilver stuff. I thought the prison break sequence was the highlight of the whole film. I mean, it wasnt perfectly pulled off (Beasts dues ex machina remote control kinda bugged me) and Quicksilver magically making people punch themself didn't make sense (also, they're bullets and....Magneto) but I just thought it was a short, fun action break in a movie where most of the action was toned pretty dark and serious. Just my thoughts
I agree with you, you rube. It was a super entertaining sequence in a very entertaining movie. Who cares if it wouldn't work exactly in the way it was shown with the punches or whatnot or how much it factors into the overall plot? It' was dang fun.
The thing is, I almost never say "oh well I'll just turn off my brain and have fun" because I need my brain. But I think that because Evans was turning in such a charismatic and unique performance, I just let him get away with more than I would let another character get away with. And also since he was in and out of the movie so quick, it felt like a fun little aside. I hear a lot of people complaining that he should have been in the rest of the movie, but i think it was smart to get him out before he outstayed his welcome.
Great show guys, really liking HHH being part of the regular rotation. I like how the more fan/geek aspect to his opinions shine through.I had a mixed reaction to DoFP. i found the beginning very jarring, with the clunky exposition (which you guys commented on) pulling me right out of the movie before I ever got a chance to get into it. It then took a long time for me to settle back into the story, which I feel that I did, but I think the rest of it was coloured by that off putting intro. Due to me not being a heavy action guy, the cool fight sequences with the Sentinels didnt counteract the bad at all. Plenty of places to nitpick if so inclined, but I agree that there is a need to give a lot of leniency when the premise of the movie is mutants and time travel of consciousness (but before I act too mature,...are they really saying he recognises a guy he saw from behind over 10 years ago and exactly what he said? Prof X could have just said the line and let us get the joke. it didnt have to be a zinger....Oh, and beast randomly injects himself with his magic mutant serum while a big fight is going on around him just so he can lose all his mutant powers then go over to trapped Prof X and be UNABLE to lift the beams?...but, you know, comics I guess.)Also, the whole Quicksilver making them punch each other thing would work (I think) because time hadnt stopped, it was just moving very slowly. So while it looked like there bodies were frozen, there was momentum there. Its kinda good/bad/terrible/awesome/unnecessary/cool that we've just had the first big scale comic movie retcon! So theres that.One thing Ive liked in DoFP and Wolverine is that Jean Grey's death is carrying a lot of weight for Logan. Despite it being a porly received movie and history being even less kind, the powers that be arent letting it go. It reminds of what HHH said in TASM2 show about how Gwen Stacey's death in the comics is important due to the stories that came after it and how the event shaped things, rather than the story itself (true of so much of comics continuity)And finally, Patrick, dont think we didnt notice you mentioning that you spoke to Doug. Give him back, you hogger!
Thanks for that, Brad. Though I'm ready to discuss a movie not based on a comic book now. Like Biodome.I don't really think that the future segments as a framing device work very well. I distinctly remember sitting in the theater and about 20 minutes in thinking "this is not working for me at all." But then by the end of the film so much ground had been covered, both story-wise and through character development, that I found myself excusing what didn't work as much, like we discussed on the show. I suppose the biggest problem I have with those framing segments are that I don't feel any connection to them. It's a random future that I haven't seen evolve so there's nothing to hang my interest on. And when characters start getting "removed," shall we say, I have even less investment because it doesn't feel like it matters. It's all just an idea and doesn't carry weight in the story. But I don't think it's BAD, just lifeless because we have no reason to care.
Yeah, I'd agree with that, I think I just didnt find myself excusing it as much as you. I didnt mind the movie, and Ill probably watch it again, but after seeing it I was very surprised that it was the same movie receiving such high praise from everyone. It was...fine.
Great podcast guys. One thing I wanted to point out was that with Quicksilver' scene, the point was that he moved so fast that he was pushing his fist very quickly, so when time sped up, it would be like a punch to the face.
Alright, I'm done protesting. That makes just enough sense to make me stop complaining about that scene. And I can confirm that Rocky IV is the one with the robot. Again, the answer we were looking for was ROCKY IV. That is all.
Wonderful podcast as usual, Patrick and Heath. Keep up the great work!
Great podcast guys - just watched this last night and really enjoyed it! A true testament to how well it pulled me in: In a fairly empty theatre with basically a couple people in the center of each row, about 6 smelly (seriously) hipster punks cozied right up next to me (with no buffer seat!) laughing at the most inappropriate times (like Xavier shooting up his healing serum?!) and I wasn't just distracted and uncomfortable the whole time. Movie magic!I watched all of the X-Men movies leading up this one (excluding X-Men Origins: Wolverine because never again) and I agree with most of what Patrick said about all of them. The first one was a big deal at the time but has lost some luster, the second one is mostly really good, and I thought (watching it for the first time and not being intimately familiar with The Dark Phoenix Saga) The Last Stand was actually not bad and fits in well with that original trilogy. In some ways, taken as a whole, I liked it more than First Class which, after a GREAT first half, tanks a bit in the second - I mean, come on, that fairy chick buzzing around spitting at people looked f'ing retarded. I feel like Days of Future Past mostly takes what worked best from all of the movies and remains solid from beginning to end.Surprised to hear the biggest beef was with the Quicksilver stuff because as I watched it I felt like it was my "worth the price of admission alone" scene. Maybe it helps that I already really like that actor from "American Horror Story" and don't know shit about Quicksilver, but I just thought that was a remarkably well-choreographed and executed scene. And Brad and Luke above have already explained why the punching stuff works, so just stop it! :PAfter a couple real bummers (for me too) it was really nice to hear a podcast with everybody happy about what they'd just seen! Hope there's a couple more of those this summer!
I had a similar theater experience, Sol, except it was obnoxious teen girls laughing and commenting at every damn thing, even stuff that was not particularly funny or noteworthy. And yet, I still had a blast with the movie, ESPECIALLY the Quicksilver scene, which you characterize perfectly as the "worth the price of admission alone" scene. I hope they use him more in the next movie.
Yeah - it was the same during TASM 2 - there were young people laughing hysterically at everything even remotely resembling a joke - I mean I guess I envy them in a way (hard to begrudge someone laughter) but it makes me wonder just how wide the generational "humour gap" is and what it means for the future of comedy...
Ugh I had a crying baby and a kid running around the aisles at my showing of X-Men. Who brings little kids to a 10pm Saturday night showing of X-Men of all movies? Hire a babysitter, or ask your parents to watch them instead of dragging them out to late shows.I really felt like tripping the kid after the fourth or fifth time he ran by, but I probably would have been ejected or hounded by an angry mob.
WOW - can't even imagine that and it shouldn't be fucking allowed - matinees of purely kid movies are the only place babies or kids that can't sit still should even be considered appropriate - I think that would've made me indignant enough to actually say something.
How didn't everyone know that he would use the same actors from the first x-men? Two were used in the wolverine and used in the first scene of DOFP. It was a given they would use them in the end as well